GUNS DON'T KILL PEOPLE, OR DO THEY?

[blueberryhill]

On Facebook, there are several sites honoring victims of Sandy Hook and parents' dedication to stopping gun violence, and plans to sue gun maker. I posted my comments as a tribute to the parents and you would not believe the comments, i.e, the usual '"guns don't kill people", guess i will sue my knife as it cut me, and the most ludicrous of all, it was all a hoax.... What.....people really believe that. We have all talked about guns in the hands of crazies, more mental health facilities, earlier identification of potential killers, etc. There is no one solution, but it should not be easy to obtain a gun in our country. We lead the World in deaths by guns (and I don't want to hear about how you are going to sue your car for making you crash or whatever). Yes there are crazies with gun, but we read every day about stupidity. Several people suggest arming school teachers. Is that really probable and a good decision overall. There are some of you I would want around me if threatened by someone. However, i think i believe that many of us, 5'6" and 125-130 lbs, even armed with a gun, would be overpowered by the bad guy and they (me) would be shot dead. Anyway, I told these crazy nutcases to get off of these sites unless they could respect the parents/families of victims and offer possible solutions to problem instead of whining, arguing incessantly about guns and saying this never happened. It dawns on me how many stupid, clueless people out there should never own weapons of any kind. How can we keep weapons out of their hands? I know this won't stop criminals, etc from getting guns. I have heard all the arguments, but to do nothing is irresponsible IMO. You may not agree with my analogy, but 2 years ago in May, I had a bad case of shingles (no, it is not a venereal disease). You have virus in you if you ever have chicken pox. People are more prone to getting it as you age. Stupid me didn't know there was a shot to prevent it, but there is...get one. Anyway, pain is unbearable...i had shot in spine, strong drugs, nothing worked except oxycodine or something like that. I still have couple pills left over from that prescription in May 2012. Now, if i get a repeat of this disease or something equally painful, it is more difficult because abuse of these drugs is out of control. In summary, it is more difficult for me because of those who abuse drug, but I tolerate it for the sake of the abusers.....Now if we could do this with guns, e.g, do more in-depth background checks, require references, etc.....get my drift? I am left with this thought. Several people have posted on a thread honoring the victims of Sandy Hook, that this really didn't happen, it is just a part of a Gov't cover-up. Can we continue to deal with such assholes? Let's round them up and have a firing squad take care of these crazies. As i have said many times, i really have to stay off of Facebook. I hate people more every day.....

[Midwest Spy]

Guns allow people the opportunity to kill without being right on top of someone, knifing them or beating them with a rock or baseball bat. I think that gives those that are borderline thinking about killing the ability to actually do it. Far less messy and gruesome. Also, far less chance of someone escaping or fighting back.

They also allow someone to commit mass murder in a timely fashion.

An obviously desperate man killed at least 6 people today in a Philly suburb at 3 different locations. If he had to knife everyone to death, he may not have killed more than one.

We just passed the second anniversary of Newtown and absolutely nothing has changed in our society, and NEVER will.

I just wish gun enthusiasts would at least do us the service of never again uttering, "If someone legally carrying a firearm was present this tragedy would never have happened."

Guess what? "good guys" with guns are never around. And please, don't anyone go try to dig up some story.

[HairOfTheDog]

Philadelphia Spreedom

Well, while a terrorist was busy holding 13+ people hostage with a gun in Australia for over 16 hours and killing between 0 and 2 people in the process (unclear yet as to whether they were killed by the terrorist or the police during the raid), another disgruntled American had to come along and steal the terrorist's thunder.

A pissed off ex-husband and dad, again. He's thus far shot and killed 6 people in 3 locations in less than 5 hours, and kidnapped his two children in the process (the kids have since been found safe where he stashed them after crime scene 1).

Just try to top that, Australia!!!



The shooter is another former military person who went apeshit and started shooting up people. Decorated ex-Marine, Bradley William Stone -- 35 (pictured above), is on the lam after killing his ex-wife and five others. LE has launched an extensive manhunt; they fear the death toll will rise and are advising locals in Pennsburg to stay inside.

http://fox4kc.com/2014/12/15/six-dead-in...ladelphia/
http://www.wjla.com/articles/2014/12/6-d...09820.html

[blueberryhill]

This is awful; didn't see much in news about it either. Guess it is only breaking news if Kim K has her butt on cover of magazine...
I would imagine his ex-wife knew he was a nutcase....Sorry i will have to wait to read your referenced sources.....Only comment i can make without reading details is that the ex had probably complained about him before and was told they couldn't help until he actually did something, like assault or kill her....If so, guess some laws should be changed. I have heard of stalkers killing their victims and were reported, but laws prohibit action until someone is hurt or killed.

[FAHQTOO]

On Facebook, there are several sites honoring victims of Sandy Hook and parents' dedication to stopping gun violence, and plans to sue gun maker. I posted my comments as a tribute to the parents and you would not believe the comments, i.e, the usual '"guns don't kill people", guess i will sue my knife as it cut me, and the most ludicrous of all, it was all a hoax.... What.....people really believe that. We have all talked about guns in the hands of crazies, more mental health facilities, earlier identification of potential killers, etc. There is no one solution, but it should not be easy to obtain a gun in our country. We lead the World in deaths by guns (and I don't want to hear about how you are going to sue your car for making you crash or whatever). Yes there are crazies with gun, but we read every day about stupidity. Several people suggest arming school teachers. Is that really probable and a good decision overall. There are some of you I would want around me if threatened by someone. However, i think i believe that many of us, 5'6" and 125-130 lbs, even armed with a gun, would be overpowered by the bad guy and they (me) would be shot dead. Anyway, I told these crazy nutcases to get off of these sites unless they could respect the parents/families of victims and offer possible solutions to problem instead of whining, arguing incessantly about guns and saying this never happened. It dawns on me how many stupid, clueless people out there should never own weapons of any kind. How can we keep weapons out of their hands? I know this won't stop criminals, etc from getting guns. I have heard all the arguments, but to do nothing is irresponsible IMO. You may not agree with my analogy, but 2 years ago in May, I had a bad case of shingles (no, it is not a venereal disease). You have virus in you if you ever have chicken pox. People are more prone to getting it as you age. Stupid me didn't know there was a shot to prevent it, but there is...get one. Anyway, pain is unbearable...i had shot in spine, strong drugs, nothing worked except oxycodine or something like that. I still have couple pills left over from that prescription in May 2012. Now, if i get a repeat of this disease or something equally painful, it is more difficult because abuse of these drugs is out of control. In summary, it is more difficult for me because of those who abuse drug, but I tolerate it for the sake of the abusers.....Now if we could do this with guns, e.g, do more in-depth background checks, require references, etc.....get my drift? I am left with this thought. Several people have posted on a thread honoring the victims of Sandy Hook, that this really didn't happen, it is just a part of a Gov't cover-up. Can we continue to deal with such assholes? Let's round them up and have a firing squad take care of these crazies. As i have said many times, i really have to stay off of Facebook. I hate people more every day.....

I'll agree with you about the hoax thing...I don't get where that comes from in someones mind at all. It makes me furious and I can't imagine what it does to the parents of those kids when they come across that BS.

I would also agree with certain stricter gun laws for law abiding citizens. I also think that if a child gets a hold of a gun and kills someone or themselves, the parents/guardians should be charged with involuntary manslaughter and a lifetime ban on ever owning a gun again.

Why are you so intolerable of anyone elses opinion? Why do you let it upset you so much. You know exactly what you're going to get when you click on those links so I guess you get what you ask for. I'm guessing we're on the opposite end of the political spectrum. You don't think I get pissed when I see ridiculous shit that makes me want to punch someone.
For example...I want to throat punch damn near anyone that has any once of faith or respect for the worthless POS POTUS we're stuck with for two more years. It boggles my mind that anyone can see any good in him at this point. Or...I want to punch someone when I see anyone actually thinks Micheal Brown was an innocent upstanding young black man and not the worthless thug that he was, and got what he deserved when he went after a cops gun.

But alas...I've learned to turn the channel, or click off the link when I start to feel my blood pressure rise. After all, we live in a civilized society, and everyone is entitled to their opinion no matter how stupid it is.

If you wanted to be off FB, you would be off FB.

[Duchess]

I would imagine his ex-wife knew he was a nutcase.

A Philly news crew were reporting outside of her home and the reporter said he had talked to several neighbors who told him that the ex-wife was very open about her fear of him, she was afraid he'd kill her. It has also been reported that the others who were killed were all people connected to her, I took that to mean family and/or friends.

[HairOfTheDog]

I would imagine his ex-wife knew he was a nutcase.

A Philly news crew were reporting outside of her home and the reporter said he had talked to several neighbors who told him that the ex-wife was very open about her fear of him, she was afraid he'd kill her. It has also been reported that the others who were killed were all people connected to her, I took that to mean family and/or friends.

I think he may have killed the ex's fiance when he killed her.

He definitely had a familial connection to the murder victims in the other two towns.

Snip:
"She would tell anybody who would listen that he was going to kill her, and that she was really afraid for her life," said Evan Weron, a neighbor of Stone's ex-wife, Nicole Stone.

Stone had a "familial relationship" to all the victims, Montgomery County District Attorney Risa Vetri Ferman said.

Read more: http://www.wjla.com/articles/2014/12/6-d...z3M0wIC6tF

[Duchess]

It looks like he was trying to wipe out her whole family. Jesus.

Investigators say the first shooting happened in Souderton at about 3:30 a.m. During a news conference Monday evening, Montgomery County District Attorney Risa Vetri Ferman said Stone fatally shot his former sister-in-law, her husband and the couple’s 14-year-old daughter. Ferman said the couple’s 17-year-old son survived being shot and was taken to a hospital in Philadelphia.

Ferman said Stone then went to a home in Lansdale and fatally shot his former mother-in-law and former grandmother-in-law.

According to Ferman, Stone then went to the Lower Salford home of his ex-wife, 33-year-old Nicole Stone, and fatally shot her. Ferman said Stone then took the couple’s two daughters, but he dropped them off at a neighbor’s home in Pennsburg shortly after.

Story

[HairOfTheDog]

Shit, how effin' sad for his kids. They lost their mom, grandma, great grandma, aunt, uncle, cousin...

Looks like piece of shit Bradley Stone took a page out of piece of shit Ron Haskell's playbook. http://mockforums.net/showthread.php?tid=7275&page=13

Anyway, thanks for the update, Duchess. It seems the ex-wife's fiance wasn't shot or killed and the kids were kidnapped at the third crime scene, not the first one. I stand corrected.

I hope Stone is captured soon -- he's a loose cannon, to put it mildly.

[HairOfTheDog]

We just passed the second anniversary of Newtown and absolutely nothing has changed in our society, and NEVER will.

Very little has changed in terms of gun control since Newtown. You're right, MS.

I'm not personally advocating in favor of increased gun-type bans or quantity restrictions, but definitely an advocate for universal background checks, tighter coordination between mental health professionals and NICS administration, full prosecution of straw purchasers as accessories (in my view, this actually has improved since Newton), and mandatory legal repercussions for adults whose children are afforded access to guns and then accidentally shoot themselves or others.

The NRA wields an eff load of power and influence though, obviously. Big political donors. So, even moderate improvements in gun control move forward at snail's pace, if at all.

I think that's probably one of the reasons some Newtown families are going for the gun manufacturers now -- maybe they figure there's more than one way to skin a cat.

In today's media:
The families of nine people killed in the Newtown school massacre filed a lawsuit against the maker and sellers of the Bushmaster AR-15 rifle used in the shooting, saying the gun should not have been sold for civilian use because of its overwhelming firepower.

Full story: http://news.yahoo.com/families-newtown-v...35892.html

[blueberryhill]

[quote='FAHQTOO' pid='382702' dateline='14186




Why are you so intolerable of anyone elses opinion? Why do you let it upset you so much. You know exactly what you're going to get when you click on those links so I guess you get what you ask for. I'm guessing we're on the opposite end of the political spectrum. You don't think I get pissed when I see ridiculous shit that makes me want to punch someone.
For example...I want to throat punch damn near anyone that has any once of faith or respect for the worthless POS POTUS we're stuck with for two more years. It boggles my mind that anyone can see any good in him at this point. Or...I want to punch someone when I see anyone actually thinks Micheal Brown was an innocent upstanding young black man and not the worthless thug that he was, and got what he deserved when he went after a cops gun.

But alas...I've learned to turn the channel, or click off the link when I start to feel my blood pressure rise. After all, we live in a civilized society, and everyone is entitled to their opinion no matter how stupid it is.

If you wanted to be off FB, you would be off FB.
[/quote]

I am tolerable of other opinions; it is the stupidity and lack of common sense that I get upset over. You didn't have to tell me you leaned right. i knew from your beliefs as expressed on here. Don't think I have ever made a negative post about your opinion. I think, even though you and some other Mockers, don't like our President, but IMO, you should not disrespect him; he is making some unpopular decisions, but something has to get the ball rolling with those do nothing Republican congressmen. Give some praise where it is due.....It is also my opinion, that you are the intolerant one by calling Mr. Obama a piece of shit President. He was voted into office twice by our citizens. I want all this name calling to stop and that has been my goal, not to be intolerant. I didn't write nasty posts when Bush was in office. Let's see, he started a war based on false information. I argued politics with friends, but I never once called him a piece of shit.
I am going to continue to post about my experiences on Facebook. I am not ready to quit cold turkey. Our opinions are just that, Opinions, but I try to research cases, not blindly believe everything written, and read. I just hope you don't say you'll pray for me if I don't watch Fox news like one of my ex-friends (just kidding, we are still friends). I think you are taking all of this way too seriously.....just please don't call our President, a piece of shit.

[cannongal]

In summary, it is more difficult for me because of those who abuse drug, but I tolerate it for the sake of the abusers.....Now if we could do this with guns, e.g, do more in-depth background checks, require references, etc.....get my drift?

This is the dumbest thing I have ever read from your fingertips (and you make some incredibly stupid statements).

If your DR doesn't know you well enough, or trust you enough to prescribe a pain med when you need it, and you "tolerate" that for the sake of the abusers, you're a fool.

If you think laying down and giving up freedoms because of other peoples actions is ok, then you might as well give up the freedom to drive, to walk, to breath.

The Gov't can run your life for you, but some of us like to run our own lives.

Several people have posted on a thread honoring the victims of Sandy Hook, that this really didn't happen, it is just a part of a Gov't cover-up. Can we continue to deal with such assholes? Let's round them up and have a firing squad take care of these crazies. As i have said many times, i really have to stay off of Facebook. I hate people more every day.....

So you want to round up everyone that has a different opinion than yours, and shoot them, but yet you say your 'tolerant' of other peoples opinions?

The next time someone doesn't like your opinion, is it OK to put you in front of a firing squad?

[FAHQTOO]

[quote='FAHQTOO' pid='382702' dateline='14186




Why are you so intolerable of anyone elses opinion? Why do you let it upset you so much. You know exactly what you're going to get when you click on those links so I guess you get what you ask for. I'm guessing we're on the opposite end of the political spectrum. You don't think I get pissed when I see ridiculous shit that makes me want to punch someone.
For example...I want to throat punch damn near anyone that has any once of faith or respect for the worthless POS POTUS we're stuck with for two more years. It boggles my mind that anyone can see any good in him at this point. Or...I want to punch someone when I see anyone actually thinks Micheal Brown was an innocent upstanding young black man and not the worthless thug that he was, and got what he deserved when he went after a cops gun.

But alas...I've learned to turn the channel, or click off the link when I start to feel my blood pressure rise. After all, we live in a civilized society, and everyone is entitled to their opinion no matter how stupid it is.

If you wanted to be off FB, you would be off FB.

I am tolerable of other opinions; it is the stupidity and lack of common sense that I get upset over. You didn't have to tell me you leaned right. i knew from your beliefs as expressed on here. Don't think I have ever made a negative post about your opinion. I think, even though you and some other Mockers, don't like our President, but IMO, you should not disrespect him; he is making some unpopular decisions, but something has to get the ball rolling with those do nothing Republican congressmen. Give some praise where it is due.....It is also my opinion, that you are the intolerant one by calling Mr. Obama a piece of shit President. He was voted into office twice by our citizens. I want all this name calling to stop and that has been my goal, not to be intolerant. I didn't write nasty posts when Bush was in office. Let's see, he started a war based on false information. I argued politics with friends, but I never once called him a piece of shit.
I am going to continue to post about my experiences on Facebook. I am not ready to quit cold turkey. Our opinions are just that, Opinions, but I try to research cases, not blindly believe everything written, and read. I just hope you don't say you'll pray for me if I don't watch Fox news like one of my ex-friends (just kidding, we are still friends). I think you are taking all of this way too seriously.....just please don't call our President, a piece of shit.
[/quote]


My post to you wasn't nasty at all...sorry if you took it that way.

I refuse to have any respect for a man that has no respect for the people he represents or our country in general. I gave the man a chance when he was elected...he blew it...he's shit in my eyes. You're free to say whatever you want about Bush.

[Maggot]

I don't think its do nothing Republicans, I think its not caving into the Democrats demands. If one side says "this is what we want" and the other side says "That's a stupid idea that will do more harm than good" its not a do nothing, its a disagreement. The Democrats do the same thing stonewalling bills brought to the Senate. But you don't hear people saying the "do nothing" Dems. Its a bit off the mark and one sided.

[Cutz]

I'm from Montgomery County. That dude is only 4-5 years older than me.

[SIXFOOTERsez]

I don't think its do nothing Republicans, I think its not caving into the Democrats demands. If one side says "this is what we want" and the other side says "That's a stupid idea that will do more harm than good" its not a do nothing, its a disagreement. The Democrats do the same thing stonewalling bills brought to the Senate. But you don't hear people saying the "do nothing" Dems. Its a bit off the mark and one sided.

I agree, from what I have seen the Dems try to do with gun control was over reach and try and hose over everyones rights and spend a shitload of money on give away programs that would be near impossible to track. Specifically the "Enhanced Background Check" legislation, $400 Million? Really? There were 2 or 3 paragraphs concerning the actual background checks and how to manage them, the rest was all about giving away money and limiting what law abiding citizens can do.
Fortunately the "Do Nothing" republicans stopped it.

[Maggot]

Wait till the majority changes and the President vetoes every bill that lands on his desk. Will he be considered a "Do nothing leader"? Probably not but people need to remember that he was the most liberal Senator in Washington before he was elected, riding dreams, wishes and wants he left out reality and common sense just because he thinks on the liberal plateau. When things go South he tends to blame others or claim ignorance.

You just never know what dream he conjures up the night before and no matter what advice given him he does what he wants, as he would rather watch ESPN than hear anything derogatory against him. He has surprisingly thin skin.
The new surgeon general will surely raise the hackles of the pro gun groups and that was in the plan from the start. He hired a politically motivated hack and another "yes" man. That is not very surprising throughout this administration though and par for the coarse.

[HairOfTheDog]

Well, gentlemen, I too will be glad to see Obama outta office in two years -- time served.

But, who's gonna reset things appropriately domestically and in terms of foreign relations?

You seem like all-in Republicans, based on your posts. I agree with the Republicans on some issues and the Democrats on others and am not party-devoted. I wonder if a candidate who independents can really get behind will emerge next year? I sure hope so.

For anyone who wants to see little change in gun control or to see loosening of existing federal policies, Jeb Bush has publicly announced that he is seriously considering a 2016 presidential bid. He might be their ticket?



Even if he were smarter in terms of gun control and self defense laws, I'd not vote for the man.

I wonder if another Bush stands a chance in hell of getting elected. I kinda think one might.

[Duchess]

Did you hear my snort all the way out on the West Coast?

[HairOfTheDog]

I didn't hear the snort, but I hear the voice in my head telling me that I gotta get my ass moving.

I'm driving to Sacramento in an hour -- taking my niece to see her favorite band at the Ace of Spades. Crossing my fingers that traffic is light and it doesn't start pouring again.

It would really be something else if we ended up with another Bush leading the country in two years. It could happen. If it does, you're gonna have to be more specific when you exclaim, "It's all Bush's fault!" Haha.